How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

General Discussion About the 1974 DeFeo Murders and related topics

How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby Victoria Principles » Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:31 am

I heard the sign was just put up weeks or a couple of months before the murders. Does anyone know how long the sign was up?
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby scipio-USMC » Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:22 am

Let me guess you heard it on the Internet... According to High Hopes it was placed there shortly after moving in to Christen the house so to speak.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby Victoria Principles » Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:32 am

scipio-USMC wrote:Let me guess you heard it on the Internet... According to High Hopes it was placed there shortly after moving in to Christen the house so to speak.


Actually the aliens in the UFO told me.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby BooshaGirl » Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:02 am

Victoria, I've wondered the same thing. I recall reading in "High Hopes" that it was put up shortly after moving in. I wish we knew where that sign is today. When did it disappear? Who took it? Was it simply tossed in the trash? Did the Lutz family burn it in fireplace because George was always cold? What? WHAT? So many questions.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby scipio-USMC » Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:28 am

BooshaGirl wrote:Victoria, I've wondered the same thing. I recall reading in "High Hopes" that it was put up shortly after moving in. I wish we knew where that sign is today. When did it disappear? Who took it? Was it simply tossed in the trash? Did the Lutz family burn it in fireplace because George was always cold? What? WHAT? So many questions.


It was taken down by the family before the house was sold so Lutz never even saw it. What the family did with it is anyone's guess.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby BooshaGirl » Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:33 am

His grandparents? Gosh, I wish we knew what they did with it. Is it up in a dusty attic somewhere? Did it burn up in the fire that destroyed one (or more) of the portraits (if that story is true)? Did they bury it with Ron, Sr.? Arg.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby scipio-USMC » Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:44 am

BooshaGirl wrote:His grandparents? Gosh, I wish we knew what they did with it. Is it up in a dusty attic somewhere? Did it burn up in the fire that destroyed one (or more) of the portraits (if that story is true)? Did they bury it with Ron, Sr.? Arg.


Whether his grandparents took it or different family members is unknown. We just know the family took it down before placing the house on the market. It would be like asking about any other personal belongings of theirs, we simply have no way of knowing which family took what. Katzenbach and Osuna like to pretend they interviewed the family but they didn't. All they got was a woman who met Ron in 1985 and married him in 1989. I for one am not curious about such personal issues though and have no problem with them keeping silent.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby BooshaGirl » Mon Nov 04, 2013 8:09 am

Yeah...I have no problem with the family keeping silent, either. It's much more dignified of them to stay silent than to "capatalize" on the murders years later...or become like the Kardashian's (puke).

I'm just naturally curious....and morbidly curious about these kind of things. I also wonder where the bodies are from the Edmund Fitzgerald wreck. Only one body was ever seen by researchers...and it was floating outside the wreck 580 feet down in Lake Superior....more than 20 years after it sank. No bodies were ever seen through portholes or cabins...I am just fascinated by these kind of mysteries.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby kathyM » Mon Nov 04, 2013 8:28 am

Yep, me too. I like to have all the answers to every question or it drives me nuts trying to figure it all out! :)

I wonder if there is an attic full of their stuff somewhere but I bet more than likely the relatives got rid of it rather than having it around to remind them maybe? I need answers! :(
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby scipio-USMC » Mon Nov 04, 2013 8:30 am

BooshaGirl wrote:Yeah...I have no problem with the family keeping silent, either. It's much more dignified of them to stay silent than to "capatalize" on the murders years later...or become like the Kardashian's (puke).

I'm just naturally curious....and morbidly curious about these kind of things. I also wonder where the bodies are from the Edmund Fitzgerald wreck. Only one body was ever seen by researchers...and it was floating outside the wreck 580 feet down in Lake Superior....more than 20 years after it sank. No bodies were ever seen through portholes or cabins...I am just fascinated by these kind of mysteries.


The corpse found near the bow of the ship had a beat up life jacket on. There is a large debris field where bodies could be or have been and there still could be in the remaining sections, looking through portholes is not completely reliable. Any that exited the vessel could have been food for animals, suffered natural deterioration, been carried away by currents or been covered by silt. The life jacket didn't help save his life but did stop the body from being completely covered over.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby VintageBoy91 » Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:40 am

It's strange, I always thought the "High Hopes" sign was still up during the Lutz period in 1975/76. :think:
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby BooshaGirl » Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:38 am

Scipio, the waters are so cold and dark down there, though--there's not much marine life to eat a body...and that's why the body that was seen was so well preserved. I had to pull over in my car when I heard on the news that a body was seen. Fitz sank on November 10, 1975 and there were many dives to the wreck, but no bodies....until that July day in the mid-90's. I never considered that they COULD be buried under all those taconite pellets. Hmmmmmm. Good thinkin, Lincoln!
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby FoxyP » Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:28 pm

It's strange how certain shipwrecks grab one in the stomach region - 'Big Fitz' is one such. Perhaps it's just that I loved the Gordon Lightfoot song so much (he changed the lyrics as it seems crew negligence was likely not to blame). There was also a very good docudrama made about the sinking that suggested the EF either bottomed out on an uncharted reef or broke it's back on the surface. I'd like to think the missing 28 crew members are still within the two unbroken sections as it's a maritime grave. It must be awful for the relatives not knowing whose body was spotted.

It's also curious that no sign of remains from the hundreds of bodies that were known to have gone down within Titanic were seen during the many mini-sub trips within the bow section of the wreck. I recall Robert Ballard saying he would have expected to find something trapped somewhere. There are, however, photographs of curiously positioned clothing and shoes on the sea bed that could suggest they once contained lost passengers.

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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby BooshaGirl » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:30 am

yes, I agree with both--your Fitz and Titanic statements. The Titanic, though--is in salt water. I think that erodes bodies no matter HOW cold and dark (or deep).

As for the Fitz, I definitely think it shoaled. Then in the storm, the waves were so violent, she took a nose-dive. All the pellets rolled to the bow, and seeing as the ship was longer than the water was deep, the nose hit the bottom, another wave crashed over and it split. I don't think the captain is to blame. That ship was being tossed about like mad--with the radar out, there is no way he could have known how danerously close he was to "six fathom shoals." anyway, that's my theory.

I was just a wee girl when this ship sank....I remember it like yesterday...and on November 10, I will remember them all and strike a bell as I say all the names of the 29 men aboard.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby AMRA » Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:58 pm

scipio-USMC wrote:It was taken down by the family before the house was sold so Lutz never even saw it. What the family did with it is anyone's guess.

Thanks. I've wondered whether that was ever there while the Lutz's were in residence.
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Re: How long was the High Hopes sign up before the murders.

Postby horsysauce » Wed May 04, 2016 3:18 pm

VintageBoy91 wrote:It's strange, I always thought the "High Hopes" sign was still up during the Lutz period in 1975/76. :think:


I thought it was too?
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